Okay, first the rant: OPC, or Other People’s Children.
Maybe it’s in part because I’ve been observing other people’s children with none of my own to cherish that I notice this stuff and irks me so. I like to think it’s because I do not subscribe to certain permissive methods of child rearing.
So, when you bring your children into a public, professional setting such as a BANK, you don’t let them run circles around each other and let out ear-piercing, blood-curdling screams of delight and laughter whilst they annoy the other patrons.
I couldn’t believe this lady. She sat there trying to talk logic to her 5-year old who thought it was hilarious to chase her toddler sister and make her scream. And my throat clearing and nasty glare didn’t seem to sink in much. And you can bet her children knew that and amped up the running and chasing and screaming and you could tell they thought they were being pretty cute.
You don’t talk logic to children in situations like that. This is when the word NO comes in real handy and it needs to be delivered in a clear message. And if they can’t handle that, they need to be escorted out of the room, restaurant, what have you until they’re ready to listen to Mommy. Honestly, what is so difficult about that? Are you afraid to teach your children boundaries? Are you afraid to teach your children that sometimes we need to use the Inside Voice? Are you afraid to teach your children to be polite and respectful and understand from an early age that the world does not revolve around them?
Maybe because I live in Kaliforn-i-ay but I have seen so many obnoxiously out-of-control children in stores and restaurants. And for some reason, now that I’m pregnant, I find them — or the parents rather — even more annoying. It’s really not the children’s fault, of course. They’re relying on the adults for rules and boundaries and clearly they’re not getting them. But I just wonder what happens to these children when they grow up. I understand not wanting to repeat awful childhoods and poor parenting… but going to the other extreme is just as bad.
When we went in for our nuchal transparency scan last week, it was the same thing. A pregnant mother, her husband and their 5-ish daughter. Talking in their Living Room Voices — all of them — in a waiting room where everyone else was doing their best to be discreet, etc. Like I want to know how pregnant you are? Or that you think this Orange Frosty recipe would be great and what do you think, honey? This woman also called her husband ‘Daddy.’ It was just plain weird and as her daughter was particularly beautiful, I couldn’t help wondering if there wasn’t a little Oedipal storm brewing. Heaven help them, I grew up with one of those (my oldest sister, my mother and my father) and it wasn’t pretty. And it turned my sister into a monster, to say the least.
The world feels like a crazy place, many a day, and getting crazier by the minute. And I have to tell you, I think certain parents aren’t helping much.
***
So enough of the ranting… the cat is out of the bag. I called my brother the afternoon of our scan last week. The DH told the BIl/SIL. He was on the fence about telling already but as he also decided not to attend the wedding in Paris at the end of this month, he decided that this would be a good reason on top of the fact that we simply do not have the cash it would take to fly him over there and stay in a hotel for a week. Not the mention that he actually really doesn’t like going back there. Italy, no problem, especially if I’m in tow… but not so much his homeland.
My brother’s reaction was disappointing. One of his first questions was ‘how is your health?’ which I think basically meant ‘can you do this at 44/45?’ Gee, thanks. I do love him, and I know he means well, but he can be such a total clod when it comes to being supportive. I sent him the scan jpg and I got a short reply in return. He did say that it was ‘wonderful’ and ‘great news’… but his heart didn’t seem in it. I don’t know if it was the DE factor or what, but it was pretty disappointing.
We did discuss how I’m going to break this to the rest of my family, and if I even wanted to. I do want to, but I think I will simply send them a birth announcement. I always, always, always want to type ‘assuming we get there’ after sentences like that. But lately, I’ve been refraining. Come hell or high water, I’ve got to stay positive. I’ve come to realize that constant worry is a big part of parenthood, so I’d better get used to it. I don’t want to be a ‘nervous nelly’ mother and it’s really not my style. So… I’ll let them know when the baby gets here. It’s very sad, but there is just not relationship there. I love them, but they are so toxic and dysfunctional and wounding. If I got the comments above from the brother I do get along with… you can only imagine what those characters could dish out. There’s lots of crazy families out there. Mine is crazy AND mean. So I’m not setting myself up for that. It saddens me so much to think that my child will not have relationships with them, or their children. But I know it is for the best.
We also told our accountant and health insurance broker, as a baby has implications in both areas. Our accountant in particular was very happy as he had seen the many, many medical bills and fruitless attempts at getting any of this written off (so f*cking unfair!!!) in the past few years. A few years ago we learned that he and his wife also played the Infertility Game. They opted to go straight to adoption, and what a time they had of it. Anyway, he gets our pain… and now, our joy.
The BIL/SIL were actually pretty wonderful. Sent us an email the next day with congratulations and that they were hoping for the best for us and how excited they were to think that they’re baby could have a cousin very soon. They said that if we needed anything, anything at all, not to hesitate to call or write. Now THAT is what you want to hear from a relative. I don’t know what is going to happen with us – meaning me, DH, BIL and SIL – but wouldn’t it be funny if we ended up being wonderful friends and close. Not going to get my hopes up, but I sure wish it could be so.
We did a video conference with them and they held up the baby. So, so, so beautful he is. So perfect. And he’s a happy baby. Not all babies are, it’s very interesting. But this one just radiates happiness and contentment and that all is right with the world.
Babies give us hope. Babies remind us that we were once untainted, unscarred, unafraid and so willing to trust and be open. Babies are cool. Can’t wait to meet mine!
I am so with you about the trying to teach kids logic thing…Alex and I have had this discussion many a times. Depending on the age, sometimes their little brains just can’t process logic yet – but they sure they aren’t mini adults – but they sure can process a firm “No!” or a swift removal from the the situation. So with you on this.
No more “if we make it”, ok? I don’t know about you, but the way my tummy is growing, there are no longer any other options but to be convinced that there will be a baby in December!
By: Christina (Retrogirl) on June 9, 2009
at 11:41 am
Oops – guess my brain isn’t working too well this morning…let me translate…what I was trying to say is that kids aren’t mini adults.
By: Christina (Retrogirl) on June 9, 2009
at 11:43 am
Man, can I relate to EVERYTHING you just wrote on the obnoxious kids and the wrecked state of parenting. The pendulum is so far opposite where it was in the 1950’s that I’d rather have the 50’s back! Kids going ape shit wherever and whenever and mothers that are OBLIVIOUS – like they’ve so given up that the kids can set the place on fire and they wouldn’t bat a lash.
You know what would solve it? If airlines fined parents for out-of-control children who scream obnoxiously throughout a flight, if restaurant owners told patrons they must leave if the child is screaming, if banks and other establishments did the same.
Trust me, when parents are seriously inconvenienced because their child is running like wild and screaming, the entire state of awful parenting would end – FULL STOP! But, as long as these idiot parents themselves are allowed to proceed with their dinner, shopping, flight – without any consequence whatsoever, things won’t be better.
Reasoning with a toddler only demonstrates the flagrant stupidity of the parent. If I was an inch out of line, my mother would just give me the evil eye and I’d shit my pants and straighten up. She didn’t have to spank me often ’cause I knew she was definitely capable! So a side glance from mom is all I needed to simmer down immediately. And, really, learning control and discipline has served me well in life.
By: Sky on June 9, 2009
at 6:34 pm
I am going to make a confession. I am really worried about one of those parents. I always knew I wouldn’t be, but now I have found how hard it is to not want to give our precious snowflake everything she wants.
I guess the good thing is that I am aware of my weakness. I know it does not serve LB or the greater good to indulge her. I am reading books like Love and Logic. I also feel a responsibility to other infertiles out there to have well behaved children.
Still . . . I know now it will be much harder than I thought.
I’m sorry you didn’t get a better response from your brother. I am positively thrilled for you!
By: Kami on June 9, 2009
at 8:31 pm
good for you for staying so positive AND self protective– gosh this is hard and people can be so cruel intentionally, unintentionally– thinking of you and happy some of your responses were *just right*– you deserve happy things and happy people being happy for you.
I know I am!
kate
By: mekate on June 10, 2009
at 12:59 am
Trying to bite my tongue, but you know you can tell me to STFU if I step out of line.
Several conflicting thoughts here. First, we’ve all seen bad parents. They are clueless and probably don’t give a crap. I’m not defending them, and they probably would get pissed at me if I tried.
However… some day when you are lucky enough to have a child (SO glad things continue to go well and that BIL/SIL are being supportive!), that little darling WILL push the boundaries in a public place. Even if you use corporal punishment (which we don’t, you can ask us about what we do that works for us without hitting or yelling if you’re curious). And you can leave said establishment to reinforce the expectation of behavior, and it will work, *most* of the time, especially if you are consistent. But kids are masterminds at finding us at our weakest moments and exploiting it.
I have flown numerous times with infants and children, and from my experiences (and those I’ve discussed with friends) NO ONE ever wants to be “that” parent with the horribly miserable kid that can’t be consoled. No excuses for the parents who check out and don’t even try; I’m speaking of the ones who ARE trying and are near tears themselves from the effort. I flew when Tiny Boy had colic and reflux, and one time it was especially awful. I did EVERYTHING I could, and nothing helped. I was so exhausted by the end of the flight. And if anyone had said to me “it’s called baby Benadryl” I would have cold-cocked them.
It is very, very easy to be judgmental when we are not the ones dealing with the behavior; it is quite another to give that overwhelmed parent a sympathetic smile and try to help distract the kids while she finishes her business.
Unless you’ve walked in those shoes, you can’t know what it’s like. In general, I try to give people the benefit of the doubt, because I still clearly remember the infertility and pg loss, and understand that you can’t always know what is going on for that person in that moment. Hopefully they are doing the best they can with what they have available to them in the moment.
By: Tonya on June 10, 2009
at 4:30 am
I know what you’re trying to say, Tonya, but I think you’re missing the point of what I was saying. Maybe re-read my post? There’s a HUGE difference between a parent that’s honestly trying to do a good job and console a child (even without success) and parents who allow their children to run wild in public (the screaming children in the bank) or (knowingly or not) teach their children to have no respect or awareness of others when in public (the clinic lobby family.) A huge, huge difference between the two.
I think it’s important that you know that in both cases, neither women (or the father) were ‘finishing business.’ The woman in the bank was sitting on the couch waiting for her husband to finish his business. She had her minds and hands completely free to deal with these children. Ditto for the family in the waiting room. There was nothing stopping her from showing her child that using the Inside Voice was the right thing at that time — except that she appeared to not understand what the concept of Inside Voice is about herself. Nor did her husband, as they discussed various personal affairs and ideas at FULL VOLUME in the waiting room. It was beyond rude.
So suggesting that I should have ’smiled and helped them out’ is, to be frank, really off base in this instance.
I’ve seen parents trying to deal with a child having a justifiable meltdown in public and my heart always goes out to them. What I observed and commented on above was not at all in that category.
And if I may so – and I think I will cuz it’s my blog – I’ve walked in those shoes. Having children of one’s own does not mean that you can’t experience and understand the trials and tribulations of effective, healthy child-rearing. I had a hand in raising my brother who is 7 years younger than me, and I was a nanny to two very young children in France, one of whom was a very petulant and nasty 5 year old. No, they weren’t my children, but I had a significant role in raising them. So much so that the parents begged me to stay a 2nd year.
I know all too well what it’s like to have children be difficult or insensitive in public. (And again, I’m not talking about a child having a meltdown over something that is a real problem for them, but children who are out of line. The situation you refer to in your comment is very different than what I’m talking about.) There is such a huge difference between condoning and supporting that behavior and lovingly teaching children how to behave. ‘No’ can be a very loving thing to say, and exactly what a child needs to hear. And in the case of children I saw, it was exactly what was needed in those situations.
Finally, not sure why you brought corporal punishment into the discussion. Are you assuming that what I am suggesting as good parenting would lead to that? I actually do not support corporal punishment except in rare cases. And I’m not even sure about that yet; I may choose not to ever use it at all. Just hope you’re not making assumptions from my post about any of that.
I don’t think going through infertility should shield us from facing and dealing with some of the more difficult aspects of child-rearing. Indulging a child because you love them so much and it took so long and so much effort for them to get here is not healthy love in my book. A child cannot understand what you went through, and there is no need for them to (until perhaps when they are much older, young adults even.) A child born from any kind of ART treatment is a child like any other, and deserves the same good parenting so that they can grow up to be happy, healthy, well-adjusted people.
By: onwardandsideways on June 10, 2009
at 5:09 am
Sorry I offended you. The additional detail you provided made it more clear that the parents you used as examples were clearly not even bothering to parent (I didn’t get that from reading or rereading your OP, you said the bank mom was trying to reason with the older child). And the only reason I brought up corporal punishment is that is was mentioned by another poster. I was not trying to imply that it was something you had mentioned.
In retrospect, I think I was responding more to another commenter than to your post, and I’m very sorry for that. Feel free to delete my comments if you wish. Next time, I’ll email you directly to discuss something that catches me funny. Mea culpa.
By: Tonya on June 10, 2009
at 5:45 am
No hard feelings, Tonya. I went to bed thinking about it and wishing I’d waited until I was less tired to respond. Then I fell asleep… lol
Your post was a *tad* patronizing (’someday you’ll understand…’), but re-reading it, I totally get that you probably had a bad experience on that plane and I bet you got some dirty looks. I always feel bad for parents in those situations because so many people are so intolerant of children. I mean, you really get the feeling they just don’t like children, you know? It’s weird. (Hey dude, you probably screamed just as bad!) For the record, in that situation, I would have been the person who smiled and tried to distract your baby. Poor little guy.
And yeah, these are definitely different situations. Sorry I didn’t make that more clear in my original post. No need to delete your comments unless you really want me to.
By: onwardandsideways on June 10, 2009
at 4:13 pm
You are a sweetheart for leaving me that comment– I will respond I promise. I wanted you to know that my logical rational mind agrees with you– but both who I am and my situation makes the DE decision not so simple. Thank you for just saying it, you ARE being supportive- support does not always look like YOU GO GIRL, sometimes it looks more like hey I am worried you are wasting time and setting yourself up for heartbreak! Thank you- truly-for your support- and I’ll write more when I can. Warmly, Kate
By: mekate on June 11, 2009
at 2:11 pm
I felt the same way– shoulda slept on it! Thanks for hearing me out and giving me the benefit of the doubt. I’ll try to watch that condescending tone next time– yikes!
By: Tonya on June 12, 2009
at 4:29 am